Hoops

With his ring will Bogut be the GAOAT?

That was my point. That our rise started pre-LJ. Its first big leap was at Atlanta 1996 when we were pretty competitive with the USA, and Timms was our leader and best player at that time.

... and of course her Opals achievement are pretty legendary. The Opals rise to regular medals level began before LJ. It began when Timmsy was leading the way.

Hard to fully gauge Timms because she was on the back end of her career when the WNBA started and much of her prime years were in Europe, but personally I'd have her somewhere close to Penny.
Being an All Star starter alongside Cooper, Swoopes, Thompson & Leslie - all of whom are hall of fame level - tells you what kind of esteem she was held in.

HO, just in this thread alone, which is full of hoops fans, plenty of people mentioned LJ and only one mentioned Penny. That's a common theme. Lauren is very well known and rightly so for her achievements. Penny, not so much.

If you're including females then LJ wins and Penny Taylor is a clear second. 3 WNBA rings in which she played crucial roles, multiple All Star, World Championship winner with the Opals in which she was MVP of the tournament. A criminally underrated player, and achievements all over the globe far exceeding any of our men.

Any discussion involving woman players has to involve Michelle Timms. While no LJ, at her time of playing for the Mercury she had the highest selling player Jersey in Pheonix, yes even above the Men in the NBA. That alone should include her as a possible GOAT discussion point.

Whoops -got to put Penny Taylor ahead of Sandy!

I take the Olympics and World Champs as more important than the NBA, and Gaze wins there. Sure, playing NBA year after year against the world's best athletes rates, but so do the games against the best in the world.

Oscar Schmidt WAS the best in the world outside the NBA for many years, and he would have been huge in the NBA if he'd wanted to go there, but he chose not to (from memory).

Patty is an excitement machine but he would never have had 100 NBL games of 40+ points against some very strong imports and locals, Luc wasn't just a bit player on the Bulls, and Delly deserves kudos for working his butt off.

However, in terms of world basketball, my GAOAT is LJ, followed by Bogut, Gaze, Mills, Luc and then possibly Sandy Brondello.

Ingles and Exum have only played one season though. Delly has had two decent seasons including significant playoff games this season. Overtime others may overtake him, just calling it as it stands right now.

Fair call on Anstey, he did play three seasons and 155 games. Didn't have the starting roles other guys mentioned in this thread have had, but worth including in the discussion.

Korver and Gaze are the same height...

If Longley was a 'styrofoam' centre they wouldn't have kept him for three straight Championships. Clearly he fitted into the chemistry and played his role or the Bulls would have just traded for any random 7 footer.

The NBA did take internationals in the 90s, guys like Divac, Kukoc and Petrovic were great. The Aussies at the time just weren't good enough to get a regular spot, aside from Longley.

If you're talking ranking according to individual NBA stats/recognition aside from Championships it's
Bogut
Mills
Longley
Dellavedova

I think Gaze would be more highly regarded in the NBA in this era. tbh... I think the standard just isn't the same as the 1990's & early 2000s.

Until this finals series, I would serious believe that Heal is a far superior player to Delly.

I think Bogut was right to make his assessment as being superior to Longley when he was drafted. But, sadly, Bogut has had some extremely rough breaks. I think he is amazing to still be walking, let alone playing ball. So, his championship is some good luck (being traded to a contender), and a whole heap of positive thinking, great medical staff and hard work. Bogut is great, and will be remembered as such.

But, I still think that to be considered the greatest Aussie ever, he needs to be compared to what other Aussies did at International Level & the current guys just haven't done that yet.

I remember having a lot of hope for the 2000 Olympic team achieving a medal. Maybe I'm jaded, but I just can't see them achieving a medal either, despite how many have NBA contracts are on the team.

Anon #529, the tail end of Gaze's NBL career was definitely characterised as much by his gamesmanship and favourable ref treatment as by his ability, but in his prime he really was an awesome player. On the shitty Tigers teams of the late 80's opponents could focus on him without much risk of being burned by his mediocre teammates, but he still averaged phenomenal scoring numbers at a very respectable efficiency.

I'm not going in to bat for him as being greater than Bogut, Longley & Co, but the man could play.

Gaze was a great player in his own right though. Let's not totally write him off based only on lack of NBA success. I will always believe that he could have been a valuable player in the right situation.
Exum has already done more in the NBA than Gaze ever did but I doubt many would call Exum better than Gaze if his career ended today. Ditto Heal or Anstey.

* that should have said a level "above", not a level "about"

Depends on what your personal criteria are, but there's no doubt in my mind that Bogut's best was a level about Longley's best, and only injuries have prevented him from making him the undisputed greatest.
He has surpassed Luc in terms of games played, games started, and career averages. It's really only the 3 rings that Luc is ahead on, and those are a far bigger reflection on their respective teammates than their own individual greatness.

LJ would have a pretty big case to be in consideration if your factored in the women.