Hoops

Rob Beveridge Signs on with Hawks for 4 years

KR argues for the sake of arguing. When it suits he becomes very very technical, for the sake of winning and argument as opposed to simply engaging in a conversation. Own worst enemy, so ofcourse he gets jumped on when he says even one stupid thing.

IMO 2015 Wildcats weren't ruined by injury, we were ruined by poor recruitment (DeAndre Daniels)

The comparisons are silly, both have done a great job in Perth.

Bevo's four years were:

2010 - finished first, won championship

2011 - ruined by injury, SF loss

2012 - finished 2nd, no HCA, lost a classic grand final series due with CJ Bruton producing one of the great individual series

2013 - finished 2nd, lost Damian Martin for the GF

Gleeson's three years are:

2014 - finished first, won championship

2015 - ruined by injury, SF loss

2016 - finished 2nd, got HCA thanks to other results, won championship

The differences between the two come down to things like Damian Martin being fit or not, and getting HCA in the GF due to other results.

No question Gleeson has benefited from Beveridge's work, but plenty of coaches in the past have wasted what's come before them, so it's a credit to Gleeson he has been smart enough to use the strengths from Bevo's time and add in his own flavour successfully.

Kings are serious about dramatic change and were targeting Bevo.

http://www.theage.com.au/sport/basketball/illawarra-hawks-resign-rob-beveridge-before-sydney-kings-could-steal-coach-20160314-gnimqs.html

"KR is the new Mattic of hoops"

Very poor comparison.
KR responds with counter-arguments, not just a mindless flurry of nasty personal insults.

Koberulz under attack, quick Chalmers he needs your help! Ahh off season banter good stuff.

KR is the new Mattic of hoops. "Don't you argue with me because I am a POM and I am always right"
I hope you aren't a POM KR.

Redhage has hardly been the scoring machine he was under Bevo and Scott Fisher. Matt Knight has been in and out due to injuries just like he was under Bevo.

Greg has had his role steadily reduced under Gleeson die to the Ennis, Prather and Daniels additions over the years. Damo has flourished under Gleeson to a point that you can say he is playing above his potential.

you keep slapping on about how Gleeson only did so well coz he inherited some super squad from Bevo - but the opposite is true - Bevo inherited a super team in 2010 and won a single championship

That's not the opposite of Gleeson inheriting a good team at all, but apart from that, Bevo inherited the following players:
Brad Robbins
Paul Rogers
Shawn Redhage

One championship and seven semi finals appearances between them, and Rogers was lost to injury early in the season and never returned. So really, Bevo inherited two players with a combined zero championships, zero grand final appearances, and four semi finals appearances. That's not 'inheriting a super team', that's three players. That's fewer than he inherited in Illawarra (Demos, Davidson, Coenraad, Foreman, Martin).

Gleeson inherited:
Damian Martin
Greg Hire
Jesse Wagstaff
Matt Knight
Shawn Redhage

That's five players, which is half a team, all significant contributors. Combined 12 grand final appearances, 16 semi final appearances, three championships.

Three inherited players started the grand final games, compared to just one for Bevo.

Gleeson also added James Ennis, and it's pretty hard to fail when you have that.

despite having the best years of Knight / Redhage / Lisch / Martin he could not win another

Redhage missed the latter half of the 2011 season including all playoff games and the Wildcats still came within two fluke threes by Kevin Braswell of claiming the title that year. Damian Martin was badly injured in 2012, and missed the grand final entirely in 2013. I'm not sure what you think 'best' is, but I'm pretty sure it at least involves being on the court.

thats just like saying that Sydney were a better team this year becuase they didnt have the same players

No, it's not. Your argument is that Childress is one of the worst players in the league because Sydney sucked.

I think there was a whole thread on this but to summarise Kobe's argument: "Bevo is a better coach because I say so" - LMAO

you cant just invent random standards then proclaim Bevo to be better because you measure him against a different standard - thats just like saying that Sydney were a better team this year becuase they didnt have the same players

you keep slapping on about how Gleeson only did so well coz he inherited some super squad from Bevo - but the opposite is true - Bevo inherited a super team in 2010 and won a single championship - then despite having the best years of Knight / Redhage / Lisch / Martin he could not win another

Man I love the way you go about. Can picture you pressing post, then yelling 'BOOM'

<blockquote>Rings will always be the best possible radar for success.</blockquote>Firstly, that's not what radar does. But secondly, no. A whole lot of things affect whether or not teams win championships. Players, coaches, injuries. To simply point to someone as having won more championships and claim that they're better is utterly ridiculous. Or is David Stiff really that much better than Leroy Loggins? If Redhage hadn't been injured in 2011, or Martin hadn't been injured in 2012 and 2013, or Lisch hadn't been injured this year, Bevo could have won championships in all those seasons. I mean, take this post from earlier in the thread:</blockquote>Gleeson did what Bevo could not do with the Cats, that is beating the Breakers in a GF series.</blockquote> That's true, but Gleeson also did one other thing Bevo didn't do: he faced New Zealand in a playoff series with his full roster healthy. Take Martin out of the Wildcats lineup and the Breakers are probably champions right now. And that's exactly what happened to Beveridge in 2013. <blockquote>The fact their are other ways too break down success etc is because so few actually win it all, but when they do, they immediately go to the head of the list.</blockquote>So in 2000, you're contending that Paul Pochintesta became one of the best players in the NBL? Do you not see how ridiculous this line of thinking is? <blockquote>If you dont think this is the case, then probs lay off everyone else for their opinions, because you havent got the cred you think you do.</blockquote>Or, alternatively, you're wrong. Given that you're some random anonymous person on the internet, I'm really not too fussed what level of credibility you assign to me. <blockquote>So according to Koberulz we can never compare any 2 coaches unless they have the exact same team to work with.</blockquote>No, you just have to <i>acknowledge</i> that they didn't have the exact same team to work with, and use a more in-depth analysis than 'one of them won more games than the other'. Remember, the consensus pick for coach of the year this season finished 7th. But people acknowledged that he had almost no budget, and no decent players, and got way more out of them than was expected. Nobody could have got that team to a playoff berth, but plenty of coaches would have ended up with the spoon.

Both coaches have their strengths. One factor that no one has brought up is how the quality of Perth's facilities and program enhances a Coaches success.

It's very possible that had Bevo and Gleeson had exactly the same teams that they won championships with in somewhere like Townsville or Cairns perhaps their success would not of been replicated.


They are both quality coaches, lets leave it at that.

So according to Koberulz we can never compare any 2 coaches unless they have the exact same team to work with. So does this extend to players, cant compare Magic to Bird, they played with different team mates, different conferences etc etc

That was pretty dumb thing for someone who jumps on everyones very sentence on here Koberulz. Rings will always be the best possible radar for success. The fact their are other ways too break down success etc is because so few actually win it all, but when they do, they immediately go to the head of the list. If you dont think this is the case, then probs lay off everyone else for their opinions, because you havent got the cred you think you do.

Bevo was smart enough to never recruit Corey Williams in the first place.

Gleeson took a team with Corey Williams and a bunch of role players deep in the playoffs. What is you're point?

If they both had the same team, you could judge on results.

Gleeson took a championship team and won a championship. Bevo took a new group of players and pushed the eventual champions in the semis despite having a healthy Kevin Lisch for less than ten minutes.

"Comparing the two based just on who raised the trophy at the end of the year is silly."
Yeh so silly to judge on results - much better to judge it on the universe according to Kobe

The solution is already there. The infographics are on Twitter also which feeds onto their webpage.

Well this thread went to shite pretty quick. Well done boys, your all winners.

I have already provided the solution Train which you have simply ignored.

Gleeson did what Bevo could not do with the Cats, that is beating the Breakers in a GF series.

"Be good if I have an instagram account or perhaps even simpler get them published on the austadiums website of even better still publish own their OWN website."

So if your that obsessed with the crowd figures stop your bitchin and get an Instagram account. Why do you care so much what the attendance figures are anyway ?

He had less to do, so even if he achieved less he could still be ahead of Bevo in terms of results.

Ok, so if it's silly to base it on who won a championship this year (as stated in this point in time), how about this season's head to head record? My count is 6 to Gleeson, 1 to Bevo.
Also, I do reiterate my comment earlier- I am a Bevo fan btw and would still have loved him back in Perth, as have also confessed to being a Gleeson hater . But at this point in time, the results go to Gleeson, and as such based on that he is better THIS season.

Be good if I have an instagram account or perhaps even simpler get them published on the austadiums website of even better still publish own their OWN website.

Wildcats always put up crowd numbers on their infographic which they posted on their instagram site usually an hour or so after each home game was played.

They didn't do this for the playoffs though.

From memory, the smallest crowd Perth got during the season was approx 10,200, and the largest 12,000+ (achieved twice).

You can easily look this up if you go to their instragram page and trawl through all the pics during the season.

"How can anyone know what the average crowd was when all of the official figures were never published."

Well when you have been a member since the Cats moved to the Arena and most of the crowd figures were published it doesn't take rocket science to make an educated guess.

http://www.austadiums.com/stadiums/stadiums_crowds.php?id=340

Aside from the semi finals I doubt very much attendances dropped under 10K There are also crowd figures missing from that site for the last regular season matches against NZ and 36ers which had a big crowd( over 12K).

"Not crap" and "better than Rob Beveridge" are different things.

Bevo coached a brand new team to a competitive semi finals series without their best player for all but ten minutes. He got more out of Ellis, Weeks and White than any other coach in NBL history.

Gleeson got a championship out of a veteran team with playoff experience and a ton of chemistry.

Comparing the two based just on who raised the trophy at the end of the year is silly.

I have to admit there have been times I have been a Gleeson hater, but do think at this point in time, as the championship suggests, he is the better of the 2.

Are you for real?

Ho Hum! Another thread derailed!
Back on topic- congrats to Bevo on gaining a substantial contract at the Hawks. Well deserved.
I have to admit there have been times I have been a Gleeson hater, but do think at this point in time, as the championship suggests, he is the better of the 2. I was hoping for a Bevo return, actually moreso Bevo to be the new Boomers coach once Lemanis steps down.
Anyway, all the best to Bevo and the Hawks fans. You have a great one there! Make sure you hold on tight, you're in for a great ride. I just pray it's not at the expense of the Wildcats. Lol

I can't stand the Cats and most of the Internet Warriors on here for them BUT arguing about their crowd figures is like taking a feather to a gun fight.

How can anyone know what the average crowd was when all of the official figures were never published.

Yes I agree that 13090 is 13,000+ *roll eyes*

Perth averaged around the 11000 this year, still getting criticised *rolls eyes*

Yeh you must have missed the 13,000+ people we got to the grand final

Perth burying the Mrs Bevo story like their recent crowd figures ;)

Dazz do you a deal, if we can get Bevo's wife off social media, will you go too! I mean the amount of dribble that has to be sifted through, leave her alone and stick to the thread surely.

As stated in the Article, Bevo's family will be joining him.
Now if only we could ban his missus from Social Media...
Do you think Bevo uses an agent? Or would he just let his wife negotiate his deals for him?

The Wildcats aren't interested in perpetuating her drama.

Or they should just keep it about basketball and move on, good thing they didnt make an issue of it. Train is right, buy a Woman's day subscription and move on.

Why ? If your after gossip and drama maybe you should stop by the local news agency and pick up the latest issue of Woman's Day.

Shame that the Wildcats didn't mention it once. If what everyone seems to think is true the Cats should have said so. Maybe they should have even mentioned publicly about the complaint.

Nothing in the wife story, when they looked at the tape, it was proven that his family was actually instigating the abuse, not the other way around. Quite comical.

In the usual way of coaches Bevo says he now needs to re sign the core group. Claims that they all have their hands up are possible with Lisch, Penny and AJ allegedly available, R,Martin on Lemanis's radar the Hawks can ill afford to lose him.
Despite the best outside game in the NBL Bevo has to strengthen the inside with muscle and mongrel. Interesting times.

No one cares Anon, dont knock a good a great bball coach. Tall poppy syndrome is so out of date... and Im a 36er fan before you even start. Its great for the league to have him around, and if his wife gets into it on social media then so be it. Who doesnt these days. No need to troll and move the topic away.

So how is that investigation into the abuse towards Mrs Bevo and others going?

Both Brandt and Kazzoo are under contract, can't see Kings letting them go to Illawarra. The Kings had better start getting there coach and squad together though or they'll be where they are now last and probably gone, can't see the money lasting for ever.
It is good to see bevo stay in Illawarra and comitting long term, good for the comp and the whole region.

Interested this off season in who sticks around at the Kings... You have to imagine that Hawks look a much more desirable destination. Thinking along the lines of Khazzouh/Brandt if Lazz retired then would they find themselves in the Gong?

Well done to Bevo and I wonder if his family will move to NSW now to remain in Perth.

Interesting article says in his 5 years coaching, he has taken his side to a minimum semi final. What about the 2 years with the Spirit or doesn't that count anymore. Agree good signing for the hawks.