Hoops

R2: Bullets vs 36ers 16/10

Steindl took time to settle into the league and look where he is now, so I don't have a problem with Drmic doing the same.

Anon - As per the discussion earlier, the figure I heard the 36ers are paying out their own pockets for Ferguson they would struggle to find someone better. Is your information otherwise? Are the 36ers paying a lot higher percentage than I am lead to believe?

Ket, Ferguson although not directly the problem with the 36ers, indirectly could be, as he is on a heap of coin and in comparison to other import options that are available, it becomes a problem to settle on a lesser option in a key roster spot (import). But is what it is, 36ers full of guys who will try and have heart but this team isn't a title contender. In no way was it ever assembled to win it all.

As I see it EJ is filling the void created by Petrie's departure and in that regard I think the Sixers have come out in front, particularly in respect to value for money spent.

Ferg is probably comparable at this point to Ebi, but with a little more upside in terms of extended defensive pressure and points and Sobey, while not as composed as Gibbo, has delivered and at considerable less expense to the club.

Of course the money saved from not having the Gibbo and Peach contracts has probably been absorbed by retaining Jerome, and to date, rightly so.

Drimdog is the concern to me, geez I would just love to see him play the way I know he can. He seems like he is putting pressure on himself and doesn't look loose or in sync with the pace of the game. I hope he can replicate Ben Madgen's contributions, I believe he has that type of ceiling.

Pop, completely agree. People need to look harder at what EJ is providing. It's what we've lacked for a while.

'Jacobsen and Drimic could've been a combined salary to pay on really good import imo. neither is winning the 36ers too many games.'

Drimic may or may not make it, but Jacobsen? I must be watching different games. He's definitely a keeper from what I'm seeing.

Ferguson isn't the issue with the 36ers

Yeah he is being paid from other sources, its a very odd one, and because of it, he cant be cut. So the risk is definitely there imo But for mine, just because you get a discount from your own pockets, doesn't justify bringing in an 18 year old in the hope he is NBA ready and we reap the initial rewards. Think joey may have been doing a mate a solid in this signing, but its murky. I just think you don't cut corners in signing imports, use your money and get the best available who is ready to compete and make impact from day one. Sure TF may make it, but its not going to happen any time soon, and really the only loser is the 36ers club, as he will be gone next season regardless.

Anon 602653 - there are reports about that insane figure, but are you certain that this paid by the 36ers? I have heard the component the 36ers pay is reasonable.

If the Ferguson year works, who steps up next year. How many put their hand up from D League for a year in Adelaide under coach wright? This year was not going to be a massive spend. Hold on to the guys who work the hardest off the court, keep Randell and support him with a few young spots we need to fill.

Ferguson is on insane money for what his output is, much more than people think. But he cant be cut based on some odd things within in contract apparently. Jacobsen and Drimic could've been a combined salary to pay on really good import imo. neither is winning the 36ers too many games.

Zodiac - There are articles out there from the time of his signing with Under Armour with some figures quoted.

The numbers quoted are high but I also remember quotes about his "contract being complicated." My guess is the 36ers only account for a certain amount of his payment, with sponsorship from Under Armour and others making up the rest.

I can't be certain of course, but reading between the lines of the article at the time it seemed to make sense. Quite smart and pro-active of the Sixers to get a guy who wouldn't be within our reach if true.

Anon, aside from Kickert being as soft as butter he cares more about his shooting percentages so if he doesn't feel like he's on he just stops taking threes.

That was obvious at MU so still not sure why Brisbane bothered to sign him. He's a big man version of Gibbo always being paid way above his actual output.

Double Clutch,

I questioned the wisdom of the Ferguson signing. I would've thought he would be a relatively cheap import and knowing how much guys straight out of HS tend to struggle their first year in the pro's didn't think we would get much production out of him.

Others said he actually is on decent money, which I personally don't understand but supposedly it's what it took to lure him over here especially as he's projected to be a lottery pick next year.

If he's cheap I can understand the gamble in the hope maybe he comes good in the second half of the season once he finds his feet playing against pro's but if he's on good money as I was told on here he is I just don't get that.

Back on the topic of the game: Kickert only took one three (and he's only taken 4 threes in 3 games). Given that Kickert is such a great 3P shooter, surely Lemanis should be drawing up more plays to utilise this elite skill.

Does Lemanis like using or know how to use stretch 4/5s? Because I recall thinking the same thing while watching the Boomers: that Andersen should have been taking more threes.

36ers have probably broken the bank to keep Randle and wouldn't we all be angry if they didn't do that. Imagine the noise if he was now playing for Melb or possibly worse- for Perth! He looks like the best player we've had in the NBL for a long long time.
How long since people would get there admission value just watching 1 guy.

Because most likely we wouldn't get a stud import for the money he is on.

I'm all good for ferguson to slowly develop and by 12 months time be greats good for him, not so great for the team I support that needs a stud import NOW! How are people ok with this draft school mentality.

Randle is such a transcendent talent and just repeatedly does things that should be impossible. His highlight reel from that game alone is impressive. Even if the Sixers do stink this year, everyone should go to Sixers games for the chance to watch Randle play.

Drmic just looks like he is still finding his feet. Needs to get some belief that he belongs on the court with adults. I hope he gets his confidence up soon though, because for a shooter every shot he has put up so far has been a brick.

You wouldn't be able to pick at the moment that Drmic is two months older than Creek!

We are 66% on the road lmao

Ferguson release is so quick but sweet. Athlete, can let the ball fly and has determination even against some clearly bigger opponents. Ball skills are there. I think at the end of this 12months he is going to look far better than 1 year of college underneath him.

People forget they talk about how good Drmic was in college but isn't up to the NBL. Leaves me scratching my head wondering what side of the coin are people on.

That was an awesome game. The last quarter and OT were very entertaining.

How anyone can criticise Sobey after that performance is beyond me. Surely a break out game by him and a beneficiary of Creek going down. 21 points on a 9-14 clip with 6 dimes for good measure. Plus he used his athleticism brilliantly on defence picking off a pass late in OT that led to his fastbreak where he was ultimately blocked by Craig but still a great steal. He also changed Gibbo's last shot with a great contest. Little things like that matter.

Hardly anyone would have picked the Sixers to win that one so a great performance. It's going to be a wild ride as a Sixer's fan this season but it's great when they have these unexpected victories.

Cavolo, The points raised about how players are utilised wasn't intended to be negative for the sake of being negative.

And you're right, it's easy to forget they some of the guys under discussion are very early in their rookie years.

It's more so just concern as to how they're being used in the system. Drmic and Ferguson need to be on the end of some properly constructed sets to get their shots going and confidence up. So far it hasn't really been the case and it doesn't seem as if Joey intends to play that way.

It's just an observation more so than impatience. Especially when a few people are already calling Drmic a dud ETC.

Okay, good point re we would consider him under performing if he was a regular import. The argument would be then could we use the money we pay him to get a better local or import?

I don't know what he is on, but I would presume we would not be breaking the bank for him. We might be able to get a better import at his price point, but I wouldn't be certain of it. He's certainly been good for publicity in a crowded marketplace.

4. Games but if he were any other import, we as fans would be wondering what other options are available. I like the idea of a draft farm in the league but I wish the 36ers weren't the guinea pig for this. We needed a big talent to combo with randle and we don't have anyone. For the record I really hope ferguson makes it and goes to the show, but this is not anywhere near a good start. And saying he is playing well compared to earlier even more brutal games in the preseason isn't much of an argument.

Luuuc - Thanks for picking up on that error on my part. That was the era were the Kings were cycling through imports and under-achieving (performance wise I think I was getting mixed up with Drew Barry - who obviously being a different player who looks totally different did play eight games with the Kings a few years after Jackson, get cut and then immediately got picked up by Golden State).

Zodiac and yourself have articulated the point better than I was attempting to, and that is no one of any importance is worried that he's not dropping 20.

Exactly. It's not like he's going to step into the NBA and immediately be the man there either, so how he handles himself in this situation is highly relevant.

Drmic was a great shooter in college. Drmic was a great Junior. He is not a great pro....yet. He needs a lot of work on his body, so he can use the skills he has previously used. It will have to be a huge offseason for him. Not sure you'd build a team around him just yet. We also need to remember that he is 24, going on 25, so not exactly a 'young' player.

On Ferguson some people don't realise NBA scouts wouldn't be looking at his numbers as much as his potential and attitude playing in a pro environment on a team where he isn't 'the man' which will surely be the case in the NBA too.

He was likely never going to dominate here and it won't hurt his draft standing next year either look at Brandon Jennings he struggled badly his first pro season out of high school in Italy and was still a Top 10 pick the next year.

Emmanuel Mudiay too had an indifferent season in China straight out of high school struggled with injury played alright but hardly dominated and was still a Top 10 pick after that.

Stephen Jackson wasn't a massive disappointment, he was a promising young player who copped a season-ending injury very early on in the season.

Randle played Summer League a few times and posted decent numbers. Clearly has NBA skills

He's the best player in the NBL right now. No question.

4 games anon, 4 games.... give it time.

Exactly josh

You guys talking about Ferguson's decision being a disaster - what are you on about? So far this has been going perfect for him.

He's averaging shy of 10ppg, getting paid while learning about being a professional. You can already see improvement in his game from those early pre-season hit-outs where he was posting 0-0-0 on 0-5 shooting.

Scouts are high on him for his body, athleticism and quick release. He's now getting and making looks from post-up opportunities. In the pre-season he looked scared to step inside the three point line. You can see the star potential in him.

Remember an older Stephen Jackson got cut from the Kings and was a massive disappointment in a weaker version of the NBL in the late 90s and yet went on to have a really good NBA career.

If you were expecting him to put up 20ppg you are greatly underestimating the NBL. Not many 18 year olds can hang in this league.

The bit that is weird about Ferguson is that he had this elite talent with his shot but we seem to be nothing to utilise it. We should have a few plays to run him off some screen action and get him shots, hell he gets the shot off so quick we only need to give him a little window.

Cavalo, im sure that exactly how they sold Ferguson on the gig too (insert sarcasm). He would've been promised all sorts of things revolving around him being the man. He is setting his sights on the NBA, not a nice little stint in Adelaide. Scouts want stats and plays run for these guys, not to see well he avg 10 and 5 and they won some games. Business to all this my friend. I don't think its going to plan from Fergusons side and what he was expecting.

"Luuuc, you haven't made your mind up? Every game Sobey gets more than 1-2 mins per sub, he plays great. Check his numbers of the last two games and line them up with the time on court!"


Anon, I'm not dissing Sobey. I just don't have a handle on what his ceiling realistically is. There's certainly no questioning how much and how quickly he can impact a game.

Anon '495 - not sure if this is Terrence's team to just come and do whatever to get himself an NBA gig. Think the team comes first, fans, sponsors etc desire to also get some wins along the way!?

Oh yea, loving the journey

More than happy to give the team time, its the youngest and cheapest in the league, its exciting too, im backing Drmic in to succeed as an exanmple of patience for players adjusting to NBL.

Stoked we won without Creek, thouht we would lose for 8 weeks without creek

Just a few frustrations with Joeys coaching style/system and see it hurting a couple of our players form a bit, but hey not saying Joey doesnt do a good job, getting road wins against Melb and Bris with our young and cheap team is a awesome effort, what im saying about the system, etc are not new to me, been the same for the last couple of years, but hard to fault the performance overall, we have acheived around what i expected or better in Joeys time,

Drimic 12 minutes, no shot attempts no assists, 3 rebounds. And Ferguson must seriously be concerned about his choice to go pro. It's Randles team and I can see why when he is on, but doesn't leave much room for a NBA prospect to actually become a prospect.

I'm a Perth fan so was a neutral observer, but I watched pretty much all of that game and I must say it was one of the best games I've sat through in recent years. Not just close, but high quality.

Props to both teams.

Captain Jack, how about we give the players and coaching staff a little more time to build in season '16/17? Seems like there is a little impatience going on for some when these young bloods have just come out of college, first time playing pro men's and in the NBL. Give 'em time to adjust, learn the ropes and develop! ;) Apart from a blow out in game one of the season due to one blindingly hot quarter by the Hawks, Joey has coached the team to winning two games out of four (3 on the road) and almost snatched another after losing their captain after 5 mins and digging themselves a big hole. Enjoy the journey... :)

Drmic also looks very nervous (which can be expect) but also somewhat flustered. Hopefully its just a short phase and he can get more comfortable.

Koberulz, bad pull ups or not he has played well above his pay grade and he is a potential game changer in small spurts. Personally my mind is made up, he can play at this level.

Joe Ingles or Dan Dillon would also be great options in my guy who is long athletic, plays de, can handle the ball , run the offense a bit ala Mee or DThomas

100% agree with you MAster Cheif

Just reckon Joey will keep his starting 5 from tonight and continue what has happened thus far

I personally think we should build our aussie content around Drmic, Creek, Deng going forward, DJ if he sticks around needs to be on less $$ and maybe given a Melmeth type role in 2003 when he came off the bench, and was a impact player, as he goes missing, doesnt have enough toughness or iq to be our main guy going forward imo

See if Drmic can become a top notch shooter, but need to run some plays for him, and he atleast hustles on defense and seems unselfish and reasonably smart player,

See if Creek can become our Mackinnon/Saville

See if Deng can become our Garnett type guy

Then grab a big guy like a Maric, Holyfield, Ogilvy or even Jervis or Brandt

Another couple of imports, a scorer (Randle) and a guy who is long athletic, plays de, can handle the ball ala Mee or DThomas

Some good structure at both ends and away we go

"Teys has been seriously average this season. He does two things; miss shots and complain to the refs."

This.

Him starting is a joke.

Captain jack, I can't see Teys and Sobey being long term starters so it seems slightly ad hoc to play them in front of our younger signings if we accept that challenging this season may be a bit beyond us. Like i say, i'd start Drmic and Ferguson but have Teys and Sobey ready to steady the ship but i can accept why most can't see the logic in that.

I just don't want to see Drmic fall out of favour. He's here for two years and should be part of the bigger picture. Obviously we need to wait and see though and i can certainly see why people would oppose my position on what Joey should be aiming to do if Sobey keeps getting the job done. Certainly Ferguson for Teys though.

Anonymous 475- Yes, the postive aspects of Sobey's game have not gone unnoticed. I wasn't bagging him at all.

Great win by the Sixers! Love their intent to keep their heads up when things don't go their way, especially the very frustrating, inconsistent umpiring. They were smashed on the boards but kept at it all night.

For the Joey haters, ease up! The guy can clearly coach and has done so very well for many years. A little bit of rational thinking would clearly show you that if he couldn't coach, players, owners and peers would suss him out and he would be moved on pretty quickly. I'll choose to err on the side of trusting those in the know. Suggestion, get behind him, the team and the club and be pleasantly surprised by the work he and his assistants are doing to develop such a young squad that after only 4 games, appears to be a very exciting and competitive team. Yes, they're going to have their dumb turnovers, blood rushes to the head resulting in ill advised shots, get beat occasionally on simple back cuts or brush screens, but I'm confident they'll learn and grow from each game.

Looking forward to enjoy the ups and downs of the ride the team will provide in '16/17! :)

Teys has been seriously average this season. He does two things; miss shots and complain to the refs.