Hoops

Ways to improve NBL refereeing standards

That tech called on Craig was pretty important and appeared to be overzealous

Limited Gene pool they are rooted.

"Do we think the NBL has stopped showing certain replays where the call was heavily contentious."

Earlier in the year they were. Now they seem to replay almost every foul, it's so annoying.

I'd much prefer to see replays of quality play, and save replays of fouls for late in the game or if it is a really controversial call.

That tech called on Craig was pretty important and appeared to be overzealous

Great idea. Drop the best refs who are supposed to put in their best games week after week and then promote the ones that aren't ready if ever. See the problem. AFAIK the refs are critted after every game. Isn't that the point of having a refs boss?
The refs were are talking about are of Olympic standard and FIBA standard and most of the time they get it right. However the continual clangers they make far outweigh the good calls.

I agree with MACDUB on all 3 points. It always used to annoy the hell out of me at the A-league games when they wouldn't replay fouls or contentious stuff.

If only there was some way to stop players giving the refs grief by claiming side balls where it was clear that it was their team which put the ball out.

"Do we think the NBL has stopped showing certain replays where the call was heavily contentious. It just seems to me as the NBL pick and choose what to 'replay'. It wouldn't surprise me if they purposely chose not to replay contentious calls so that people back at home watching on TV don't see the balls up (which only lowers their opinion of the league if seen/realised the wrong call)."

I've often wondered this with other sports too, in particular rugby league.

I am somewhat sympathetic to NBL refs insofar as we have to remember they are employed part-time and simply don't have the benefits/access to development as other referees across world sport. For me, it's a case of output = input. Increase the resource and input and we'd get better referees without a doubt.

Secondly, I think NBL refs need to start giving out tech fouls to players and coaches more for complaining.

My point of submission is that the general public and the commentators idea on what's a bad call is influenced by the reactions of the players and head coaches.

Perhaps, if we can curb those reactions, it won't be as bad of a look to the general public/spectacle; right now, people see players and HC complain and that gives off the inference that the wrong call was made. If they didn't complain as much; maybe for the purposes of the spectacle, we wouldn't sit here thinking that a wrong call was made on multiple occassions.

Thirdly; just a general question.

Do we think the NBL has stopped showing certain replays where the call was heavily contentious. It just seems to me as the NBL pick and choose what to 'replay'. It wouldn't surprise me if they purposely chose not to replay contentious calls so that people back at home watching on TV don't see the balls up (which only lowers their opinion of the league if seen/realised the wrong call).

You know what's wrong with that and the FT thing is that these chumps simply aren't up to it.
Incentive based, great idea, what happens when they fail that test? FT. So when they fail to meet the mark that they are set, they get dropped to where exactly.
Repeat.
Fail.
Repeat.

How about competency based pay rates. Watch them lift their standard then.

It was mentioned in another thread about Adelaide getting so many friendly calls.
It's true, but I don't believe it results from any bias or favouritism.

There's an inherent problem when a league tries to change things by influencing the Refs.
The NBL wants a more entertaining up-temp style of game. If this were the NBA, they would simply change the rules again, but we are mostly stuck with FIBA rules.
So they lean on the refs.

Guys like Jawai get their wallets stolen by the refs, guys like Randle get a red-carpet and step-ladder rolled out.
People bitch about the soft-call given to Cotton to send the Cairns game into OT, but he is simply benefiting from the protection that has been handed out all year.

It's simply serendipitous for Adelaide that the style Lazza & Jezza want, is the style Joey has been pushing for years. If Goorjian came back, his whole team would foul-out.

Last year saw a predictably tough and gruelling grind between NZ and Perth. In the post-win festivities, Lazz and Jezza looked somebody shoved a rose-bush up their butts. I assumed it was just the failure of MU and their hatred of Perth, but whatever the reason they have pushed hard for a more free-flowing entertaining style of game.

As I said, pure serendipity for Adelaide, other teams will have to adapt.

Why? They can't get it right now. All that will do is reward ineptness.

Make all NBL refs Full-time, THE END

"Yeah and you dont think NBL refs have or do? The 6 guys in NSW for example all have senior roles in their employment. You have no clue what "sacrifices" they make to improve, to be involved or simply accept appointments during the work week.

Your comments are ill informed and naive. The "kids" that make excuses in the ABA are in the ABA for a reason."

Herein lies a big part of the problem, having part time officials in a professional league. Make them all full time, pay them accordingly, give them time for development and then make sure they meet KPI's

As long as referees continue to bet on games then this problem will always exist.

"I think the coaches can argue less with them and both referees and coaches can be a little more respectful of one another and understanding of each other's position."

Good point. It's a breath of fresh air watching Bevo on the courtside compared to every other coach going off their nut at every little thing.

Yeah and you dont think NBL refs have or do? The 6 guys in NSW for example all have senior roles in their employment. You have no clue what "sacrifices" they make to improve, to be involved or simply accept appointments during the work week.

Your comments are ill informed and naive. The "kids" that make excuses in the ABA are in the ABA for a reason.

"they just dont work in the real world"

Players/coaches make sacrifices to improve. Refs make excuses

Youre living in the past Duke. Every kid gets their ABA vision these days whether by hudl or drop box in whatever league they are reffing.

Nbl guys get a USB straight after the game to review.

Cool lets go ref practice games, in the ABA you may have refs close to where you train, practice times might suit. In Sydney for example the 6 refs are from vastly different geographical areas to wear the Kings play. Its not just geographical but employment restrictions also affect the "ability " to attend trainings when the Kings train during the day.

Some of these theories to improve are great...they just dont work in the real world

"How do you get them to "practice a little bit more"??? Please expand?"

Wasn't my comment but I'd love to "expand" on some of my experiences at ABA level, which I think lie at the heart of a lot of the problems. The old line of "Oh refs can only practice in games" always gets trotted out as some sort of acceptable reason why refs don't do more work on their art. During my tenure coaching at ABA level I tried everything short of getting on my knees and begging, for refs to:
*Referee our practice games in pre season
*Come to practice and referee our scrimmages and talk to the players about what they're seeing in different situations
*Come and sit and watch game film with us and discuss situations
All pretty valid training exercises for refs I thought and also a good way to foster better relationships. Never had 1 ref show up despite numerous invitations. From my experience apart from their poxy "action days" where they do a fitness test and go over points of emphasis for the season (which should really be points of emphasis for the first 3 rounds because they're forgotten after that) and an occasional evaluation they get no training on their craft at all. And there are loads of NBL refs reffing at that level....and it's also the breeding ground for new blood.
The most common excuse I got was "they want to be paid to ref practice games" Ok, well we're doing this for nothing but we'll scrounge up 50 bucks for them. "Oh no, the going rate for ABA is $120 (or whatever it was at the time)"
Hell we even had an annual charity game in the pre season where everyone donated their time (bench people, stadium staff etc) except guess who needed to be paid so we could have a game?
I've said it before, players and coaches work far harder on improving their game than refs do.

Blaming part time refs is a cop out.
If you know ALL the rules just watch the game & make the damn correct call.

No longer an anonymous

How do you get them to "practice a little bit more"??? Please expand?

I do think the referees could practice a little more, they could then become more consistent and everything will be fine really.

I think the coaches can argue less with them and both referees and coaches can be a little more respectful of one another and understanding of each other's position.

In my humble opinion, we need to focus more on how great the NBL is becoming and possible expansion once the league is financially strong and viable in all areas, refereeing included and allow the people we have time to improve and develop.

Finally, when we have all of our referees as pros, pay them enough to give them all the opportunities a pro players has, then we can judge them, not until then.

I think first the NBL has to acknowledge that there is a problem. Until that occurs nothing will be done

Currently 1 ref a year goes to the NBL summer league for their development camp so that already occurs.
You are not going to get any international referees or NBA people here due to timing and cash.
The NBL referees are accountable. Just like the AFL referees get dropped, its just not advertised. It doesnt happen in any other profession.
Referees are micd up... what other competition broadcasts to fans in the stadium...other than sportsears?? No one.
There is already a video review person who can hear what referees say or ask for re-review

Just because all this isn't published doesn't mean none of it happens.

It was said in a previous thread...once people stop looking at calls in slow mo, frame by frame, 18 times this hysteria will go away. If you have to look at a call twice in slow mo and you cant decide! Then the referee in "real time" at game speed gets a tick. Otherwise its an impossible job.

Have been thinking about the feasibility of an exchange program or sabbatical for a while, though I do think there is potential for conflict. Imagine if the Aussie ref cost the home team the game? haha

I wondered if we could send refs to US college exhibition games, or possibly a training program (if they exist). I thought it might be easier/cheaper in an 'amateur' league.

Can we send some commentators for internships as well?

Does anyone know what level of budget the NBL has for refs? To what extent do NBL refs rotate between states?

Though not really a development issue, I would like to see some analysis of miscalls, broken down by venue, match up, and ref (though I doubt that be published). It would be nice to have some evidence behind all the banter.

Very old, from what I gleaned, A-League referees don't referee in other leagues (glad to be proven wrong). If referees were to say referee women's competitions, would this affect their ability to officiate in men's competitions given men's comps require faster decision making because of the athleticism and speed of execution of play? I don't know, just throwing that out.

At pre-season level I can't see why referee exchange would be problematic- you're not playing for sheep stations, and LK and co are trying to forge links with foreign leagues, so why would there be any politics involved in this? It worked elsewhere (international cricket another example).

Professional refs would need to be 12 months full time, that means doing WNBL, SEABL male and female, local state leagues, occasional interstate travel to do a week in VBA , SBL (WA) etc.

There would need to be a realistic possibility of a long and financially acceptable career , this means a 10-15 year commitment by the employer and the employee.

The NBL , the WNBL and several of the state and regional associations have not coped well financially over that length of time, and several have been in administration and/or bankrupt in that length of time

This would need financial buy in from state and local associations to an entity that would reasonably expect to outlive all of them. That probably means BA, and they often sink to the level of incompetency where couldn't manage to tie their own shoelaces.

Fiba Oceania or Asia set up a pro refereee management/development/education group ? - now they could probably do it administratively, but would they do it for the privately owned NBL - or would the privately owned NBL accept the services from referee who answered to some other body - I doubt it.

1) The Refs need to be made independent. Too many instances where its blatantly obvious that instructions have come down from Lazza & Jezza. It's not the AFL. Rules are set by FIBA, we should just stick to those, and hence no need for the NBL to interfere.

2) Refs need to be made accountable. There needs to be a transparent review process, Refs need to be assessed on their performance, and remedial action taken where necessary. This old-school notion that officials are treated like demigods needs to go.

3) The attitude of Refs needs to change. If they make a mistake, admit it, change the call, and move on. If one ref makes the wrong call, the other two should overrule.

4) Refs need to be either miked up, or have an official announcer at the desk to broadcast the call. Fans get pissed when they don't know what's going on. If it was announced "that basket doesn't count because the refs called an off the ball foul on player X, for blocking player Y, before the shot was made" then fans would be a lot less livid.

5) Introduce a "4th Ref" Sitting in a video booth with a video-tech, big screens, and multiple feeds, in radio-contact with the floor refs.

We don't have enough highly credentialed ex players coming trough junior ranks.

Say if a player has retired after playing state league etc and never reffed before, are they expected to green shirt at domestic level or are they fast tracked?

AKA, as a point of comparison, our closest competitors in the A-League (truly global sport, best refs 'supposedly' on other continents, transition from part time to full time refs, players, coaches etc), now employ a whopping three full-timers, having appointed Shaun Evans last year.

http://www.footballaustralia.com.au/article/shaun-evans-named-as-full-time-professional-referee/127rvko69oakm1rhvbve69ptzz

At that level, there is no reason why the NBL can't do the same for exchanges etc, although I definitely like the idea of a cadetship program.

Hoopie, I like consistent guidelines so that, for instance, what constitutes a tech foul for dissent is the same anywhere, we eliminate the dreadup 'make up' call, advantage (or lack of it) is the same everywhere, even if we have to follow the rugby union universal guideline of a 'free hit' for the attacking team when the defending team infringes.

Some good points worth thinking about.

Anything which can fix up my main bug-bears is a winner for me, which are:
- parochialism - too many refs are intimidated by the home crowd, or provide 'home cooking'
- inconsistent calling of simple issues, such as hand-checking, charging, bullocking into stationary players, not letting a player in the air land, over-the-top coaching and criticism from players
- uncertainty around who should call what, so that all areas of the court and rule-book are covered
- make up calls instead of just reversing the call when thy make mistakes
- too much calling on 'feel' or advantage rather than by the rules

Before any of those valid suggestions are implemented they need the league to get to a point where the officiating team are full time and perhaps even a cadetship program to entice up and coming refs to pursue it as a genuine career. This part time gig is, not surprisingly, providing ref's which aren't wholly engaged a this isn't there main source of revenue and they are aware that they can't lose their job as there is no secondary level ready to step up.