Hoops

Wildcats vs Breakers, 3 Nov 2018

I've got no issue with admitting when calls favour the Cats, or that in Perth Arena games the Cats overall get a good run with the refs a lot more often than not.
If the Ware contact is called correctly then Perth lose. That's true.
Although as others have already pointed out, that wasn't the first incorrect call in the game. But people are free to play the what-if game to their heart's content if it makes them feel better, including playing it selectively.

They won't admit to it, as being little brother to the east we have an inferiority complex to cope with it - it's why it's Perthworld - on it's only little planet far far away in the galaxy WA (Wait Awhile).

Credibility? The arrogant era started sometime after Bendat/Marvin took over and once the first title was won and the new stadium lined up ohhhh boy!

There goes your credibility. They were never normal.

"Don't be stupid

I want the Perth fans to admit the refs sucked"

Utd got robbed and I'm a Perth supporter. Good luck even after the league confirming it getting anyone else to admit it though. Our fanbase are feral and deluded, back in the day they were normal but something changed after around 2010.

AD....

The NBL have said the 1OT call on Ware was incorrect, lets move on.

Melbourne fans shouldn't bitch, they get home calls too, remember when Majok fouled Beal on the last second drive? You all gloated about the non-call.

This is the return leg of the karma ledger.

Perth fans, you shouldn't bitch either when other teams get home calls.

Let's just accept every home team gets home calls.

"it is unsurprising that the cats had a lower foul count."

I don't think the discussion is about having a lower foul count, I think it's the fact they were only called for eight fouls, and that NZ took 30 shots in the paint and got three free throws, where Perth took 33 shots in close and had 21 free throws.

I won't get to watch the game til tomorrow, so I'm not making judgement either way, but I can certainly understand why discussion would come up looking at those numbers.

The Wildcats are hedging a lot more on the pick and roll this year instead of relying on the guard to fight over screens. Also neither Melbourne (after goulding got hurt) or NZ had a wing that makes you fight through back screens. Add that to the fact that 90% of NZ's drives resulted in either a kick out or a pass to the big not a shot attempt it is unsurprising that the cats had a lower foul count. Add this to the fact that with Norton, kay and white they are attacking the ring more often. You see it all the time in 36ers games - attacking the ring gets calls.
Across the league there has also been less of an emphasis on illegal screens - one of Perths biggest issues last year.

There was plenty of discussion about the 'home cooking' in the previous game too, if I remember correctly! It's not a new discussion, the reality is intense atmosphere's affect refs just as it affects players.

People realise that one of the 1161 games was going to have the lowest foul count, right?

Wildcats do get some shit calls but somehow their opponents always get a lot more shit calls. That can't be just random luck when it happens consistently over multiple years. Note I am not claiming that it is a league conspiracy. I think the refs get intimidated by a big crowd and that's why the 2 clubs with the biggest crowds also get the most home cooking.

I immediately thought of J when I saw this article on Perth Now
https://www.perthnow.com.au/lifestyle/stm/stms-pick-for-breakfast-and-brunch-ng-b88995343z

Hoot you're right but they are extremely annoying and arrogant/smug which causes these issues.

Si señor. Me gusta el basketball. Wildcats son los mejores! "Let's go Wildcats let's go!"

Fans complaining and whining about wildcats fans is peak hoops.

Wildcats have the biggest most loyal fan base. With that comes more “casual” fans - and these casuals find their way to forums.

They are always going to be more misguided and uneducated.

But they are classic red army marks that believe their team can do no wrong.

Yet people still get upset?

Personally I find it hilarious when anons who should know better get so worked up by other anons that don’t know any better.

“The foul count is a conspiracy organised between Hungry Jacks and the refs. HJs have reached their quota of free burgers for the round already, with NSW and Queensland receiving free burgers, so they didn't want Perth to tip them right over their burger budget.”

Gold.

Why stick to blaming the refs?
Clearly the hoops are biased because they allowed in more Wildcats' shots.
Maybe the floor was biased and made NZ run slower?
Perhaps its just the biased Perth air that made then play shit?

In case it hasn't occurred to you, fouling is actually a mistake, just like a turnover or missed shot. Players do actually try not to make them.
So why are you surprised that better players commit less fouls?
Why do you think Jervis only got 6 minutes? If we let him play til he fouled out would that make the refs less biased?

For whatever reason Brandt wasn't going for every board this week, so not surprisingly he committed less fouls. Had NZ benched Delaney quicker (who is about as subtle as a brick) would that also have made the refs less biased?

NZ usually travel well to Perth, but this time round looked like they walked all the way. They looked knackered and played accordingly.

Well to put it simply. You don't do when You are playing terrible defence.

5-1 with only 2 imports is not to bad of a start. Watching the game I didn't notice the free throw count. Why is perth the only team to keep winning year after year? Surely in that time they do dine out instead of home cooking?

"Moore split his finger on the backboard when attempting to get a rebound or block a shot.
he sliced it on the underside of the backboard."

Damn, that's nasty.

Hopefully he doesn't take too long to recover.
But might be an opportunity to sign a PG? Illi & Weeks not cutting it.

"Whole league knows you guys moan and winge"

Pretty sure you're the one moaning and whinging right now...

no, really. its an army of 13'000 whining b*tches.

Yes anon. Should have also called fouls on all those uncontested dunks perth gave up.

So Delaney got called for two offensive fouls, where he was running full steam ahead and not even looking what was in front of him. One of the NZ imports got called for a blatant hook right in front of the refs.

Should the refs have called those same fouls on the Wildcats to make things even, despite not doing any of those things once in the entire game?

“Whole league knows you guys moan and winge”

Pretty sure you’re the one moaning and whinging right now...

So what happened to Moore?
Must have been nasty, Perth Doctor had to come to their bench, and looked like they cleaning blood from the floor?

I liked the move of putting Dech on Webster. You basically give the kid ONE JOB, doesn't even matter if he gives up a few fouls.

I was surprised at the foul count, but at the same time I don't think a lopsided foul count should influence refs back the other way.

Webster is a scorer and in a team that desperately needs scoring he should have a green light so no issue.

I wouldn't actually care if he took 30 shots tonight (instead of the 18 he got).

He would still hit those extra 12 at a higher clip than others who are shooting (Ili 1-6, Abercrombie 2-11, Weeks 3-9).

FWIW I thought that "foul" on Cotton was total rubbish too.
Team fouls comparison is a metric I don't really rate, but it felt to me like we got a pretty good run with the refs.

The NZ roster structure does seem to fit the argument that the new ownership group pumped the breaks on spending for this season.

Seems to be a lot of guys on that roster who they wouldn't be paying big money to I'm guessing (Ngatai, Delany, Weeks, Majok, Ili). Those guys weren't exactly in strong bargaining positions for $.

Our imports look cheapish as well.

My mate yelled out "Noooo!!!!" as Vague was launching that 3. Vanilla is a totally different player this season. I did not see it coming at all. He did some good work at both ends today. Was very cool for a change to win it via some big bench contributions.

Nailed it Luuuc!

Can’t blame Webster. But Sunday did what he needed to do. Bring pressure and relieve Norton of minutes.

That bench unit with cotton won the game.

I thought Dech was huge for us. It seemed like when he came on, Corey Webster took it as a personal insult and set about trying to destroy him, except the result was a whole lot of missed shots for him, very little of the ball for his teammates. Not that Corey wasn't within he rights to try it - he was looking deadly up to that point - but the game really swung right around that time. Up until then NZ were having no trouble dealing with our defence. They took it right up to us today. 14 point final margin is not really fair on them.

Happy for Steindl too. All season he's been on a super-short leash. Being down a guard today Gleeson was pretty much forced to play him more, and that happened.

Thanks for being specific!

Which specific calls or missed calls went in Perth’s favour? All I’m seeing is everyone bitch about the foul count, ignoring the fact that NZ either launched from deep, or found easy dishes to someone under the rim, but rarely attacked the basket.

In relation to the foul count: perth wasn't playing a whole heap of defence at the start of the game, really werent in the vicinity to foul, if you disagree go back and count the uncontested dunks and layins, nz was shooting 60%. nz defence was sloppy all game both teams were on the wrong and right end of some calls.

So , koberulz in a little bit of excitment as homicide says perth will make finals

No you're right.. home cooking happens everywhere to a degree including in NZ. It's an accepted part of playing at home.

My point is that the home refereeing advantage is slightly accentuated at Perth unfortunately.

In an era where they call so many ticky tack fouls, for a team to only shoot 3 FTs the WHOLE game shows to me that the referees made up there minds before the tip off who they wanted to win.

The NBL and there refs think we are all stupid?

I don't blame the refs for tonight's results. We didn't deserve to win.

But the home advantage is an accentuated advantage at Perth due to the added refereeing advantage that Perth get at home above and beyond what any other team gets at home.

Not saying it decides games - but there is certainly some form of added advantage with the referees, even if only a little bit

Wasn't there a game up in Townsville in 2012 where one team shot zero free throws?

"Why u so concerned Macdub. Wildcats needed 50% 3pt shooting and 3 refs to scrape ahead. NZ playing the better basketball IMO."

I was concerned with exactly what happened in the end.

That is, that our offensive slump was inevitable and that I didn't see where our points could come from across the entire game - ultimately, the slump came at the most problematic time (4th Q).

7 points in the 4th quarter - miserable - that sums it up. The game is played across 40 minutes.

Anyway time for the real game now (All Blacks)

20 Free throws to 3??

Surely that is not correct. The Breakers have only had 3 foul shots the WHOLE GAME?

The referees dont bother to try and hide it anymore.

I don't think the reffing has been too bad (haven't seen the entire game though)

My one complaint is Cotton kicks his legs out on 3's, then someone makes incidental contact, and Off Cotton goes to the charity stripe. They have to stop calling that

If I was told that the game would be decided by the play of Steindl Vague and Dech i would have assumed it meant big NZ win

So anyone care to explain how kay didn't get a foul there? I guess perth just get "all" the calls

Shea has regressed to 2016-17 form.

Sub Webster on.....

Finally, FINALLY steindl is catching fire for the Cats

Finally, FINALLY steindl is catching fire for the Cats

Long has bumbled a few good chances away this game.

USF on Wagstaff is fair, given the new interpretation

But I'm not sure if I like this new interpretation.

The intent was to foul, obviously. On the other hand, no one was going to get hurt. Maybe a regular foul is penalty enough