Hoops

25+ Years. Revenge really is a dish best served cold.

LV and Cram both make some good points but im still confused as to the right answer. Ive been following NBL for a long time and ive never thought of United as being the same franchise as the Melbourne Tigers. Especially if current players are wearing retired numbers of the Tigers then i dont know how thats possible.

Certainly a stronger relationship than they have now no?

In fact I recall at one point Giddey coaching Werribee and they had a couple of Tigers playing there

I suspect you're exaggerating the extent of the "relationship"

Tigers players always played for a range of Big V and SEABL teams

"The problem for Crams argument is that the Tigers Big V and Tigers juniors was a separate entity from the Tigers NBL club for many years before the Tigers became United at NBL level"

It wasn't many years but sure.

And what did you see when they had that set up? NBL dev players playing with the Tigers Big V teams. Coaches crossing lines. Cross promotion.

How much of that do you see now?

oh and coach Anstey continued but lasted one game.

The problem for Crams argument is that the Tigers Big V and Tigers juniors was a separate entity from the Tigers NBL club for many years before the Tigers became United at NBL level

Goulding didn't continue

Returning players were Wortho, Tomlinson (who led the NBL in assists in the Tigers last year), Walker and Odigie

As I said above, United cannot claim the Tigers history, if they don't acknowledge their retired numbers.

Handing out the retired numbers of the Tigers best 2 players of all-time is a slap in the face to those players.

"I support Aussie basketball and I'm from Melbourne, so I support United"

I support Aussie basketball and I'm from Melbourne. So I support the Boomers, Opals, Melbourne Tigers and countless Aussies playing overseas. Simple.

"Everything else the owners, staff, coach & contracted players like Goulding, Walker etc remained the same"

Again, not everything else. The Gaze family and all associated with them voted with their feet. This is not THEIR club. And THEIR club is the Tigers.

I have no agenda.

I continue to support the Melbourne Tigers as a season ticket holder.

Can some people with agendas stop trying to claim United & Tigers are different clubs please. They are the same thing. The Tigers changed their nickname to United and their colours that's all. Everything else the owners, staff, coach & contracted players like Goulding, Walker etc remained the same.

United have every right to claim the Tigers history because that's who they are, the Tigers renamed. What was contentious was one heritage round United played in old Magic uniforms which was a joke the Tigers & Magic were two separate clubs.

I support them because they're the only NBL team in Melbourne (until now)

I support Aussie basketball and I'm from Melbourne, so I support United. Simple.

0f course I'd prefer if they were still the Tigers and hadnt soured the relationship with the Godfathers the Gazes. It's perfectly possible the upwards trajectory of public interest would've continued without the rebrand, but we'll never know for sure

I just think it's silly to go around pretending they're some brand new thing, when that's not true

I also love what LK has done OVERALL for the sport in this country but that's a different issue

"Just accept it, move on and support another team."

No.

If the Tigers were related to United, wouldn't the Gaze family be supporting them at every opportunity instead of the team that actually IS the Tigers at the second tier?

If all you see as being a club is a licence and a location then sure.

But if you see the club as being more than that - the history and the people - then United and the Tigers couldn't be more different.

The owner simply used their existing to licence to start his own team.

They even played in Magic jersies. Would a club who had a connection to the Tigers ever consider doing that?

LV, if you want to talk of delusion, what of the delusion that you've bought into that this is the same club to give yourself permission to support United despite what LK did to the Tigers?

"Melbourne Tigers" to "Melbourne United" I should say

They are the one and only NBL franchise named "Melbourne". It's the same franchise just rebranded

Denying these facts just makes you bitter

Just accept it, move on and support another team. (Now you have a new Victorian option).

It's other teams that are seeking revenge against Perth.
Adelaide for 2014 GF loss
Illawarra for 2017 GF loss.
United not Tigers for 2019 loss.

Have got revenge against Brisbane in 1990 and NZ in 2016 for previous losses.

Just need revenge against Sydney for 2003 loss.

Cairns aren't relavant at this stage.

The Tigers were the beginning of United

United wouldn't exist if it weren't for the Tigers.

It was literally a case of the owners deciding to change the name from "Tigers" to "United". United was not a brand new franchise.

Saying the Tigers have no relation to United takes you into the realm of delusion

Shows ya how little I saw/paid attention this season, didn't even notice McCarron in 10. Pretty good indication right there.

[They don't even claim the Tigers titles, much less any of the others.]

Actually the 4 Tigers championship banners are hanging at Melbourne Arena alongside United's 2018 banner.

United are not the Tigers.

The Melbourne Tigers play NBL1, VBL and junior competitions. They have no relation to Melbourne United.

United is the continuation of the Tigers

They're the Tigers rebranded.

Same organisation who decided to change their name to broaden their appeal.

A business move that the purists understandably hated.

Yeah, of course it's all a bit inconsistent.

Thread was meant to be light-hearted

I apologise for any offence.

The Melbourne Tigers franchise still exists just no longer in the NBL

The Tigers do hang the Tigers retired jersey's but they don't honour them. Casper Ware plays in #21 etc. Even for heritage round, playing in Tigers strip, Ware had on th3 21.

United are not the Tigers.

DB3, maybe someone correct me if im wrong but im pretty certain ive seen tigers numbers retired at Melbourne Arena.

I also wouldnt call this championship revenge on the 93 loss at all. Perth has since beaten 2 other victorian clubs since then (Giants 95, Titans 2000) and when you see when the Tigers won their other titles in 1997 and the 2000s, it came when Perth were very average and vice versa. So its not a great surprise that these 2 clubs havent played in many grand finals.

Whats more surprising is that Perth and Adelaide have only played in 1 Grand Final in total depsite no change in name, long history, plenty of success from both clubs a legitamately good rivalry etc...

United aren't the Tigers. They like to claim they are when it suits them. They also like to claim they aren't, again when it suits them.

Any doubt as to their claim of still being the Tigers could be put to rest by the fact Andrew Gaze was coaching at another club.

"Ray Gordon probably burned his uniform in the same Tigers memorabilia bonfire that Cram had"

Yes, cos that makes perfect sense

United cannot claim the Tigers championships if they ignore their retired numbers.

[They don't even claim the Tigers titles, much less any of the others.]

Actually the 4 Tigers championship banners are hanging at Melbourne Arena alongside United's 2018 banner.

The Tigers changed their name to United. But it was the same organisation. Same owners. Same coach too. The only Melbourne team for 10 years- 5 as the Tigers and then 5 as United.

It's not like United was a brand new franchise that sprung from nowhere like the Dragons or Phoenix.

I feel that the greatest current rivalry is Perth vs Adelaide as there is history, current day spice and 36ers sweeping Perth two seasons ago helped keep the rivalry hot.

Brisbane and Adelaide also have a rivalry that is undervalued as great games and fierce contests.

Adelaide vs Illawarra excites as there is a hatred there too and I love that.

They don't even claim the Tigers titles, much less any of the others.

They may have to stretch everyone's credulity to claim st Kilda's in 1979

Do United have a claim to every championship won by a melbourne club in the history of the NBL?

Yes, which is why led with the (somewhat incredible) fact that it has taken 25 years for these two teams to face off again in a GF.

And I even pointed out that there was not even a tenuous connection between the squads, as Vickerman had stopped playing in 92.

So how you possibly interpret that as me claiming that Gleeson or the current players wanted revenge, I have no idea???

Yes, the Cats have appeared in around 9 GF's in the intervening years, and Melbourne have appeared in 7 I think, yet they have never met again until this season.

And yes, amazing to think that some of the current squads were not even born in 93, and those that were, were definitely in short pants.
Although given that NBL was at its height in the 90's, I wonder how many of those kids were already dreaming of playing NBL??

As for whether the 93 result matters, well I assume Melbourne count it amongst their wins, so I guess it does.

This COULD be the start of a new rivalry in the NBL *to replace the Breakers/Perth (although I suspect Sydney & SEM will have some say in the matter)
But if so, it has been a LONG time in the making.

exactly. stupid thread. the tigers don't even exist anymore let alone play in grand finals

Ray Gordon probably doesn't care since the Tigers didn't lose this year?

In 1993 half a dozen of the players in this year's GF series were in primary school. Another half a dozen hadn't been born and the rest were in nappies or at kindy.

Not sure that the 1993 result would have been top of their minds.

OP ...It's normally classy to win graciously instead of rubbing it in.

Instead bringing this up two weeks after the event seems like you have nothing else in your life worth celebrating.

Ray Gordon probably burned his uniform in the same Tigers memorabilia bonfire that Cram had.

Bit of a stretch!

In 1993 half a dozen of the players in this year's GF series were in primary school. Another half a dozen hadn't been born and the rest were in nappies or at kindy.

Not sure that the 1993 result would have been top of their minds.

Gleeson's a Vic boy and was coaching Warrnambool and Victoria's All Stars in 1993. He would've been cheering for the Tigers back then. Hardly a recipe for wanting vengeance!

What The fuckery Dazz.
Lol.
Does that loss in 1993 still matter? Perth have won 7 more titles since then.

You my friend are a F-ing tool

We may not see the lad at pro level again, just wanted to pay my respects towards him.

Whats your fave memory of him?

Mine is recent when he knocked down all those abl long bombs.