Hoops

World Cup QF: Boomers vs. Czech Republic

Cram, I think the point being made wasn't about being "cultured" as you said, it was more that was good international-style ball has more to it tactically than the NBA. I think that's been reinforced over the years with the USA running simple stuff compared to other top countries.

What the NBA has is the bigger stars, the bigger athletes, the bigger highlight plays and the bigger marketing budget. As such, I think the Hollywood/European film comparison isn't a bad one, especially given it's using the two same cultures in the comparison.

I understand your perspective Cram but I also have to accept those same fools LK is trying to attract might ensure the league is around for another ten-twenty years and doesn't fold in two. The league is unsustainable if it has only the dyed in the wool types like us propping it up.

Am I as fanatical about the 36ers as I was 20 years ago, no, but I become more cynical the older I get and harder to impress.

So I guess the discussions about the Boomer and Czech Republic game have come to an end.

ugh. Anything featuring Corey Williams is a good example. Loud. Obnoxious. Adds nothing of value.

Continual self promotion by LK and his team. Pushing the league into buying from his own clothing company. The "landmark media deals" that seemed to be signed every year despite virtually flat ratings and the league still running the coverage for no profit. Basically the vibe of "look at how good we're doing!" despite no evidence to back it up. Teams are losing money with no outlook that will change any time soon. But they keep with the "boom" angle, desperately hoping to fool other fools into buying in. Its a house of cards sure to fall.

Cram, I think the point being made wasn't about being "cultured" as you said, it was more that was good international-style ball has more to it tactically than the NBA. I think that's been reinforced over the years with the USA running simple stuff compared to other top countries.

What the NBA has is the bigger stars, the bigger athletes, the bigger highlight plays and the bigger marketing budget. As such, I think the Hollywood/European film comparison isn't a bad one, especially given it's using the two same cultures in the comparison.

First of all, you were replying to a comment about preferring FIBA or NBL over NBA and made no distinction in your reply. Secondly, preferring FIBA over NBA doesn't make you more cultured either, and is just as laughable of a comparison.

This is laughable. You're not more cultured because you watch NBL.

ugh. Anything featuring Corey Williams is a good example. Loud. Obnoxious. Adds nothing of value.

Continual self promotion by LK and his team. Pushing the league into buying from his own clothing company. The "landmark media deals" that seemed to be signed every year despite virtually flat ratings and the league still running the coverage for no profit. Basically the vibe of "look at how good we're doing!" despite no evidence to back it up. Teams are losing money with no outlook that will change any time soon. But they keep with the "boom" angle, desperately hoping to fool other fools into buying in. Its a house of cards sure to fall.

Getting a bit off topic, but anyway... you can obviously do whatever you please with your basketball viewing, and I share your concerns about the arms race of over-spending for a league that has yet to generate any real income. But I'm curious about where the "style over substance" vibe comes from, because that's one thing I don't agree about at all. Teams are putting icing and sprinkles onto their game nights to give the games wider appeal, but this still ain't a cupcake league.

I'd just like to point out that it isn't just the Tigers getting killed that is the reason my interest in the NBL has dropped (though it is the biggest reason). The concerted move to becoming a second rate G League, overspending which will inevitably lead to further instability and general air of style over substance that means I won't watch many games when I used to watch virtually all of them (not just the Tigers).

Some will be happy to know, however, I will be paying for an NBL game this season for the first time since the Tigers were screwed over, to watch the Sixers (good mate is a big Sixers fan) play at Phoenix.

And without the Tigers going around, that's perfectly understandable. After Fitzroy died, I didn't watch much AFL for years.

"You don't have to, they're at different times, it works beautifully!"

Haha, for you maybe. And that's great. I'd far prefer the 2-4 games per week I watch over the summer to be NBA games than NBL. Even the "boring regular season" games for me are magnitudes better than the NBL.

I'm not saying the NBL is without appeal for some, but it no longer has much for me.

"Yeah I get that. That still gives you 3 months of top quality basketball. I'd take that over a full season of NBL without a moments hesitation."

You don't have to, they're at different times, it works beautifully!

I haven't watched an NBA game in years they're too boring and drawn out for me I'm not sure I'll bother again even with the NBA on SBS now. The rigged offensive rules, bad officiating & superstar calls really turned me off once they decide you're a star player you get the red carpet treatment for life. The NBA is to basketball what WWE is to wrestling.

The FIBA game is as close to pure basketball as it gets and far more watchable to me, even the NBL which is starting to go a bit Hollywood like the NBA is still great to watch and even though my Sixers were barely watchable last season I watch virtually every NBL game on NBL TV. I consider it much more enjoyable to watch than the yawn fests that are NBA games.

Yeah I get that. That still gives you 3 months of top quality basketball. I'd take that over a full season of NBL without a moments hesitation.

Sorry, that was me above. I love the NBA playoffs, because it's all real at that point and most of the teams that play with high IQ are still involved.

That's fair.

"It's entertainment and most are easily amused if what is served up looks pretty enough. Eye candy if you will. It's akin to Hollywood film vs. European cinema - you know the former is inferior but it's marketed well and easily digestible for the masses - most aren't interested in nuances and want content that is non-thinking and obvious."

This is laughable. You're not more cultured because you watch NBL.

The NBA is objectively better basketball. The players are better. The spectacle is better. The refs are WAAAAAAY better.

Sure, its a different style of game, and you can have your preference on whether that style is good or not, but don't be ridiculous.

What you have is a local team to love and support which goes toward the tribalism that makes sport great and that's the one thing we really miss out on with not having the NBA here. That, in itself is great. You don't need to make absurd statements that the NBL is the connoisseurs choice to give a reason to like the NBL.

I used to be almost exclusively NBL and FIBA, with a little NBA.

Now the pinnacle for me is FIBA ball, with the NBA my day to day watching and NBL a distant, distant third.

I don't understand all the NBA fan boys online that talk trash about the FIBA rules and style of play. I'd rather watch NBL or FIBA over NBA any day. I honestly get bored when i try watch a whole NBA game.

Dave / Makur.

If your mum hasn't put you to be for school tomorrow.... what is your definition of a better player?

For example why would you say Adel is "better" than Kay?

Kay certainly does things to make his teams win when he is on the court.

Reply #761909: Actually, you couldn't be wrongererer when you wrore this:

"If patty and mills now go down with injury sobey and gliddon would suddenly found themselves as starter
I am trying to work out how both Patty AND Mills could go down injured in a major competition, I reckon only one could ever get injured y'know?"

Do you suggest that if Patty goes down, we can always sub in Mills?

if superstars always win, why isn't THIS US team playing in the semifinals? Aren't Mitchell and co superstars, since most play as starters in the NBA? Aren't Pop and Kerr superstar coaches? Bring out the excuses - it must be someone else's fault!

And we're talking about comparing Kay with Adel and Bolden, who are reasonably close in ability. Using LBJ versus Kay is as stupid as comparing Ben Simmons and Jason Cadee.
Yes, the top US players will beat anyone else because of their height, speed, skills, understanding, etc, even teams with their own superstars such as France and Serbia and us.

If I understand your last comments, you're calling Adel, Maker, Bolden SUPERSTARS?!!! You reckon Simmons and those guys would beat the US's best?

If you're going to make comparisons, compare apples with apples instead of going for unrealistic cases.
And given that you think you can do better than Lemanis at picking a squad, GET OUT THERE AND PROVE IT. When you win your first NBL championship, then let us know and we'll apologise.

Otherwise, go grab a mirror and enjoy yourself in private, so that you stop wasting our time.

"No need to have 6 players injured.
If patty and mills now go down with injury sobey and gliddon would suddenly found themselves as starters or play major minutes for the team. That would be catastrophic for the team"

OK. Let's use you own example. I'll even assume you meant Delly and Mills.


Yes if they both go down we are up Shit Creek. But who exactly are you suggesting we would have used in their spots. Simmons would help with playmaking for sure. But he was unavailable.

Are you seriously suggesting Green an untried kid could have stepped up on the world stage in a system he is at present unfamiliar with. If you scenario occurred Goulding and Creek would probably start with Ingles doing almost all the playmaking and Sobey and Gliddon play some spot minutes while all the starters carry a huge workload. Might still pinch a game with that lineup.

Well I must be honest, no I would not pick Kay over LeBron although I don't think that is the argument you are about to make. Kay is a natural pick over Adel for backup 4 and as for Bolden, well clearly the coaching staff at the camp saw Kay doing something Bolden wasn't (if you look at some threads there are actually some video's very nicely outlining what Kay was doing that Bolden was not in the games vs Canada).
But these questions all don't matter that much as I am not the coach of the boomers squad, I do not know the system they are running and I prefer offensive bigs (Landale, Motum, Johnson) over defensive bigs anyway

#910 yes it’s either Adel himself or some one he knows.

Makur

Melbourne were absolutely stacked last season and they couldn’t get near Perth. It’s not about the best players, it’s about the best team. Even in the nba you need quality players but the best team is mostly the winner. I haven’t actually been Kay greatest fan but I can’t deny his performance at these championships, same for Creek. The back end off the bench are just that and imo would fill the void as good as any that you keep raving about.

There is no I in team.

"lemanis is such a jerk"

Are you actually Adel? That is such an odd comment, like you have taken personal offence to him selecting a well performing team

"If patty and mills now go down with injury sobey and gliddon would suddenly found themselves as starter"

I am trying to work out how both Patty AND Mills could go down injured in a major competition, I reckon only one could ever get injured y'know?

Adel and Bolden might have been x-factors, but they might just as easily have been non-factors if they were in the wrong place at the wrong time in the system, or tried too hard once they got on the court, or wouldn't follow instructions because they had the me-first NBA mindset ...

Kay has been great. Proved that he can play a role that the team needs. I was one that wasn't happy with the selection, but he's been great.

Having said that, the player management system that meant no better option than Dave Barlow as a replacement is still unforgivable.

Kays a solid backup 4. Only 1 bad game vs France so far and Batum just might've been a bad matchup.

Vs Lithuania with Landale struggling vs Sabonis, Kay really stepped up and did the job.

We don't ask too much of him except to play with energy and play solid team defence and he mostly provides that.

Whats with the Deng Adel hate.

What happened at the camp that everyone is throwing sh*t at his name ?

He's young & talented & deserves the right to try make the boomers if he wants to.

Dave should be left to coach under sixes where one player always dribbles the ball and never passes it. That’s how he likes it, problem is as soon as he’s stopped no one else can play.

Re the rankings Creek was better than Kay and Landale. Landale got some nice buckets but got beaten defensively to often. Lemanis adjusted very quick to it, first by bringing on Kay then Creek.

Czech Republic need more NBL players

Olgun's player ratings from that game:
Matthew Dellavedova - 5
Patty Mills - 8
Joe Ingles - 6
Jock Landale - 7
Aron Baynes - 5.5
Andrew Bogut - 8
Chris Goulding - 8
Nick Kay - 7.5
Mitch Creek - 7.5

Article:
https://www.foxsports.com.au/basketball/fiba-world-cup/aussie-boomers-player-ratings-vs-czech-republic-patty-mills-sizzles-while-the-bench-mob-strikes-again/news-story/20437e657cae9bac6eebcec887e280cf
(why is the board not letting me post that URL as a hyperlink?)

Czech Republic need more NBL players

"Simmons has already committed"

Now that's funny.

Anyone get any sleep last night? Today is gonna be a long day!

I saw someone on Twitter midway through the game demanding Kay be glued to the bench and never touch the floor again, insisting that Lemanis needs to figure out Ingles and Creek are our only viable four-men.

Because Lemanis is obviously struggling at the moment...

It looked like they hardly had any energy to celebrate this win. Probably a wise move to look ahead. A few looked very tired towards the end. This has been a tough schedule with a game every two days. World Cup basketball is so intense.

Unbelievable effort to make it into the top 4 without a loss. Australia's best ever world championships/cup result. With all the outrage about end of bench selections, Lemanis supplemented the predictable core NBAers -- Delly, Mills, Ingles, Baynes -- with Euro-ball Landale and valuable role playing NBLers, Bogut, Creek, Kay, Goulding to create a dependable, focused and committed unit. This core 9 have carried this team to a semi-final. One win away from a medal after a 6-0 start.

Yet somehow we still have critics of Lemanis in here obsessed with tweaking our roster in anticipation of the Olympics to include their favourite players, already cutting valuable role players. Let's see how this tournament plays out.

"It is the ultimate and makes the NBA isoball look like trash. It's a shame we only have two competitive tournaments per four year cycle. At least the Europeans get to compete in EuroBasket every two years (up until the recent change)."

I don't understand all the NBA fan boys online that talk trash about the FIBA rules and style of play. I'd rather watch NBL or FIBA over NBA any day. I honestly get bored when i try watch a whole NBA game.

How awesome is international hoops!

Well done Boomers, two consecutive back to back appearances in the Final Four at a major tournament.

Only one other team left who finiahed in the top four in Rio and we are coming for them. Revenge is sweet.

Great win. Played terrible in the first half but Patty kept us in it. Plenty of contributors in the 3rd and 4th quarters. Bogut stepped it up.

Spain and France lock in Europe's two automatic spots for the Olympics.

Yeah plenty of contributors in that one. Special mention to Bogut though for standing up when the Czechs were making a real run at us. Kay & Creek did some handy things. Goulding stayed positive despite the early misses and it paid off.

Greek , Goulding also very good.

Final four. What an outstanding effort. The spirit and fight in this team is just incredible. How awesome is international hoops!

Encore!

Mills is just wow. We're home.