Hoops

Shut Up and Dribble

Battling with Gabbert, then went on to start and throw 16 TDs 4 INTs. Yes, they would have been.

"Everyone plays both sides when it suits them."

Not only is this whataboutism again, it is false whataboutism.

"Democratic country, lol, the college system is absolute wrought, ..."

USA is a flawed democracy, #25 on the democracy index. So how is this relevant? This is an eerily similar argument to pro-China propagandists, suggesting because you don't have a perfect democracy, that democracy doesn't work. That is outrageously idiotic.

"Human rights, again lol, all countries have atrocities in there past and still going on."

Are you a troll? This is pathetic.

"...and China saying don’t poke the bear."

Yes, it is an overt warning. The CCP is used to doing this type of thing. The CCP, running China as a totalitarian country, have the ability to control the entire business sector. Think billionaires are getting too much power? Numerous cases of billionaires mysteriously vanishing for months. Everyone must fall into line. Alababa's founder, workaholic Jack Ma, suddenly resigns? Criticising the CCP leads to imprisoned, which is why billionaire Guo Wengui can't go back to China.

Democratic country, lol, the college system is absolute wrought, otherwise H Clinton would be president as she had far more votes than Trump. This doesn’t mean that I’m against Trump either just stating facts. Trump also stacked the high court with his people even though it was Obama person that should have been appointed. The republicans just stalled it so they get there people in.

Human rights, again lol, all countries have atrocities in there past and still going on. This has all got to do with money and China saying don’t poke the bear.

https://www.facebook.com/theScore/videos/416901652355578/

Isaac

“Trump was the guy who supposedly told China he wouldn't apply pressure over Hong Kong to ease through a trade deal. It's all money.”

I hadn’t come across that. Twitter?

Trump does care about money for America. He wants China to not trade as a “developing nation”, but as a “developed nation”. That change would take away some of China’s advantages in trade, production etc. His position on Syria is just as easily explained: he doesn’t want to take responsibility for leading the world, just finding trade and financial advantages for America. No money to be made in Syria.

Ultimately, Trump is an aggressive isolationist. Aggressive isolationist (Aggressive Twitter threats etc). Isolationist in that he has no interest in real diplomatic or military interventions, unless there are financial incentives for him or his country’s perceived interests.

"To much ignorance in this thread, ..."

And then proceeds to deliver a sermon of whataboutism.

"its that they have previously spoken out about issues that you disagree with eg BLM, Trump being a bum."

No, it's that people like LBJ are all for justice until it affects their wallet. Principles of free speech should be upheld, not silenced because of sensitive responses from totalitarian regimes.

Let's also dispel the myth of China being communist. It's not. It's not even close to being socialist. It has evolved into totalitarian capitalist, retaining some of the worst aspect of communism (absolute state control, rife corruption, etc) while losing all of the equality/egalitarianism ideals. China is more capitalist in spirit and in practice than USA. The cultural lack of moral concern for non-family, combined with a lack of social regulations, leads to an unrestrained extreme capitalism. It's not an exaggeration to say that 'all for oneself/family' is the guiding principle within the culture, usually manifesting as money for oneself/family. The State benefits from using this capitalist spirit while holding a firm grasp over it. Many businesses require partial state ownership to operate. Upper level government workers are literally leeches, using their power/authority to demand regular payments for businesses to operate, to get official documents on time, to get approval for imports/exports etc. For example, you might get a visit from the fire inspector informing you of [an always changing] fire code which forces the business to pay them off instead of going to the great expense to comply. It is common for people applying for even benign government positions, such as teachers or nurses in government workplaces, to need to pay the head of that workplace to get the job, often multiple times a yearly salary, just because it leads to a stable job. To become CCP/police/other authorities, it's based on networks and payoffs. It becomes open, extreme cronyism.

The culture openly accepts this exploitation of power. So when China tries to manipulate the NBA to comply with their demands of political silence, this is a normal, acceptable response. Because in China, it's typical to do anything -- just anything -- to get what you want.

This China stuff is the same logic being used against everybody protesting anything that people don't agree with. "Oh, you say you don't like issue X, but what about issues Y & Z also you hypocrite!". Fact is that everyone has issues that take priority for them - and with black Americans to me it's self-explanatory why the whole BLM thing would be at the forefront. These basketballers on the whole probably care as much about what's happening in China as Reality does - ie. sweet fuck all. I don't imagine Reality is out there boycotting China-made anything. Anon #289 is on the money. It's a dishonest argument.

hopefully the NBA can become more like the NFL

Trump was the guy who supposedly told China he wouldn't apply pressure over Hong Kong to ease through a trade deal. It's all money.

To much ignorance in this thread, have any looked the human rights issues the west have done, weapons of mass destruction ring a bell. In a nut shell Hong Kong is part China, Britain and China worked out deal, and then it would revert back to China, its there country. For f..ks sake Britain attacked the Faulklands island off the coast off Argentina because they said it was there’s, even though it was part of Argentina at one stage.

Re the nba off course they want to look after there business interests, like any other company or individuals. Morey and others should look at history before they open their mouths or Twitter or what ever is the latest these days.

Jesus. Comparing Black Americans speaking up on social issues affecting Black Americans to Kylie Jenner, an incredibly rich socialite who as far as I'm aware hasn't spoken a word about anything worth a damn.

Some "social issues" are more profitable than others.

Oh yeah, I'm sure all that public speaking circuit work makes up for the lack of his NFL QB salary. He definitely made the decision based on future earnings :eyeroll:

His final season he had 16 TDs and 4 INTs. I'd wager he's still better today than half the QBs in the league, at least.

To me this still boils down to a bunch of folks who don't give two shits about Hong Kong or any of the (numerous) human rights issues taking place in China's borders using this to attack LeBron's stance on human rights issues in his own country - human rights issues that directly impact him. LeBron's comment was dumb regardless of what he meant and a "no comment" would have been a better option, but at the end of the day he probably knows less than we do about any of it. There's a reason why China has had such a strong economy, and it's not because of people and organisations refusal to do business with China for ethical reasons.

Couple of other perspectives spotted online:

Kasparov:

I spent most of my life fighting at the chessboard & against dictatorship at the same time. It's not for everyone, and I don't like to pressure athletes for boycotts, etc. But if you openly side with authoritarians, you abandon the pretense of innocence & neutrality.

-Haven’t seen or talked to my family 5 years
-Jailed my dad
-My siblings can’t find jobs
-Revoked my passport
-International arrest warrant
-My family can’t leave the country
-Got Death Threats everyday
-Got attacked, harassed
-Tried to kidnap me in Indonesia

FREEDOM IS NOT FREE

According to ESPN's Dave McMenamin, LeBron James spoke up in the meeting with Adam Silver in China and suggested that there would be "league recourse" had a player tweeted the same thing

I think while he was trying to have his take in the media arena with a neutralised “There’s a place and time” instead he flags a position by talking and not condemning, and then doubles down by criticising Morey calling him uneducated.

You’re a dumb boy LeBron! That was a bad tweet by any measure.

Is he talking about well-paid athletes copping some scrutiny on a tour? And suggesting Morey should've waited a week rather than disrupt pre-season games?

And here's LeBron and the warm teat?

“I believe he was misinformed and not educated on the situation,” LeBron James said on the Morey tweet. LeBron added Morey’s tweet was dangerous. LeBron said he is uncertain about the future ramifications of the Morey tweet with the NBA and players.

Let me clear up the confusion. I do not believe there was any consideration for the consequences and ramifications of the tweet. I’m not discussing the substance. Others can talk About that.

My team and this league just went through a difficult week. I think people need to understand what a tweet or statement can do to others.

There’s another aspect to this, potentially.

IFF China is recognised as a developed nation, and has to conduct trade and economics as a developed nation, it will become less profitable to manufacture in China. Then Spaulding etc might shift manufacturing to Vietnam, India or elsewhere. Such developments across industries might weaken China’s economic power, and reduce the risk for speaking up against China’s human rights record.

I think the NBA are fair game for criticism on all this, enabling such over-the-top behaviour from China in their response to Morey alone, but I think it's unreasonable to expect players to ad-lib respond in the gauntlet between acting on something they've probably been oblivious to, without frustrating their clubs. Journalists trying to put players on the spot - it's a bit much. Curry gave a response about it being a serious issue needing further research which is about as much as he can probably do when put on the spot.

At least now with China and Chinese corporations pulling their support for the NBA we may get games in Australia to fill the void.

Get in there LK.

Let's stop getting sidetracked about LeBron as we know he will stay silent. He's being used as a smokescreen on here to deflect from the real issue of the NBA's hypocrisy. The league decided to enter the social justice arena over the last few years and now it's backfired on them.

What's shocking is that the Rockets executives actually discussed sacking Morey for his tweet. Yes, you read that correctly.

Harden's grovelling to the Chinese was so shameful. Doesn't really know how to address it so uses the word 'love' a number of times. Yeah, we know what you love.

@Issac Lebrons has made at least 12 recent trips to China so pretty sure he might/should have a bit of an idea about the place.

So in context its clear the NBA players only speak out when it doesn't effect the hip pocket

Of course not. As Reality wisely articulates they should care as much about everything as they do the thing they personally relate to.

& anyone who believes to the contrary is a bum.

Just an FYI

If someone does not support my view = they are wrong, should shut up and are un-[nationalityhere]

If someone does support my view = they are right and should be heard, everyone better respect freedom of speech

If he spoke on police shootings or about anything else domestic, it was never “he’s alienating half the country and costing himself money, admirable”, it was “stay in your lane”. But now it’s about money.

‘020, LeBron is American, not Chinese. You might see how that gives him a significant interest in commenting on one issue and not another.

I think it’d be great to see him say something but I don’t think he’s obliged to.


If anyone doesn’t think there is legal risk from anonymous comments, they’re an idiot. I have dozens of legal emails from instances over the years.

Ok I'll use this forum how I feel OP wanted it (forgetting him singling out Lebron).

So could this mean that say a brand like Spalding could come out and say that they support Hong Kong and try and get their basketballs and apparel and other sporting equipment produced there?

Could Spalding try and get those items made in America?

I know that the cost to produce would increase exponentially but if the quality is still the same, if not better then a brand such as Spalding which is recognisable and has a solid reputation then surely they could handle it.

If Spalding are owned by Chinese then please swap Spalding for another brand that fits those type of attributes.

Cheeky!

Poe’s Law!

#causewaybooks

#BlackLivesMatter, not Asian.

Also waiting for LeBron's take on Brexit and Saudi Arabia too, I suppose?

The topic about the time you saw Aleks Maric crossing the road?

Can you spell out the relevance here? This is a private forum with some level of moderation whereby I prune less-relevant posts as I see fit, often because there is legal risk (either from the post or those likely to come in reply) unique to my situation as the operator. As I told you then, there was more risk than upside, and as it played out there were comments in reply that could potentially antagonise people and invite the sort of legal emails I prefer to avoid because I don't have enough time to improve the forum let alone deal with lawyers.

This topic is about the expectation that anyone offering an opinion on a subject is obliged to then offer opinions on all other topics, as ranked in importance by OP. It didn't remind me of your Aleks Maric Experience, but rather the way people expect a Muslim commentator to denounce horrible behaviour after every terrorist attack.

Actually, maybe the relevance is that as a private operator, I can moderate when asked, when I have time, or when I think it appropriate. Just like LeBron can offer his opinion when he wants, when he thinks it relevant, when he thinks he's informed on an issue, or when it's Tuesday and there are tacos.

A bit rich from you Isaac, you previously blocked one of my forum posts numerous times on the basis that you didn't think it was worthwhile

I take it he offered an opinion on something you don't favour, so now he's obliged to offer an opinion on everything you do favour?