Hoops

Sixers have fourth highest paid team in NBL: Cooper

Tonight showed why R.J. Hampton said no to Joey and the Sixers in favor of New Zealand. Completely disconnected, from top to bottom.

Right, and my response to that was to ask how cheap he'd have to be for that argument to fall? There are limited alternatives to upgrading the roster. Do you bench him and trundle along if he's $200k? $100k? Anything over $70k, if you were going to swap him out thinking your roster wasn't good enough, you'd do it, right? But they didn't - so they thought the roster was chance enough not to mess dramatically. So, he's 15 and 7 and has a solid offensive skill set. What's more likely - that he's a $50k import (in the world of 2019 NBL salaries) capable of that, or that his salary wasn't a decisive factor for holding him because Joey thought they could get that fourth spot.

I think you need to separate coach and club a bit in how you think about some of these situations, BTW.

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Started 3-1. Then 3-5 after losing to the big teams Sydney, Melbourne and Perth where two were narrow defeats. Beat SEM on the road. Narrow road loss to Brisbane. Handled Breakers fine and then beat Perth in Perth. Got smacked in Melbourne, but then won the next two. 8-7 or so? The horror stretch started with losing to the Hawks in Adelaide but do you get drastic after that game or hope it's an aberration? Even after that, at 11-12 it's not end times.

Complete hypothetical:

"What if we pay out Ramone and use that import spot somehow?"
"I'm not going to cut Ramone. He's a versatile team player, doesn't rock the boat, he'll come good."
"What about now?"
"Now's not the time. We can win the next couple and make it."
"What about now?"
"It's too late now."

I never made an argument about cutting him a few weeks ago. The club as frugal as they are if they're not prepared to buy out and cut Moore and replace him they were never going to do it for Griffin.

I said if Griffin were on big money they likely would've cut him early in the season before his contract became guaranteed for the rest of the season because he was already coming off of the bench at that point. They could've then replaced him without needing to pay him out on top of it.

I suggested reasons previously?

Week or so ago, they were in the pack around the 11-11 mark before losing to Cairns and Brisbane. Before that, a 3-1 stretch where the loss was on the road to the top team. Other teams in the pack had looked shaky at times. Griffin had some stats off the bench a few times that might've given them hope.

Maybe they looked at alternatives and couldn't get anyone they were convinced would do more.

And what reason would that be?

When the discussion is "roster salaries", which source would you need it to be to consider it credible?

I spent most of my post literally suggesting why a team might not cut a player in this situation. Really, if they weren't up to it and they were getting $100k, you'd still call it, right? That could be enough to patch a team up. Moore wouldn't have been on probation. Randle is 20 PPG and is more of a drawcard. Either he's being paid a pittance (as an "unguardable" player with the $400k thing) or there's a reason they didn't make the change.

Zodiac, once again in this case Boti is wrong.

If Boti's source was (in part) Joey, do you think Joey would want people to know if he was heading towards missing finals with a pricey team?

A week or so ago, they were technically a chance. Would you rush to rock the boat in that case?

I can see how you might try to work around Griffin (like they did Wiley) rather than bring someone in cold.

Isaac, my question was more getting at the fact that "more than I expected" doesn't really mean anything absent knowledge of what you were expecting.

You obviously don't want to give an exact number, but a ballpark idea of your expectation would at least provide some context.

If Boti’s source was (in part) Joey, do you think Joey would want people to know if he was heading towards missing finals with a pricey team?

A week or so ago, they were technically a chance. Would you rush to rock the boat in that case? I can see how you might try to work around Griffin (like they did Wiley) rather than bring someone in cold. Might’ve considered the Hawks game an aberration. Then by the Breakers game, might’ve started to feel too late.

There’s also a scenario where the person who pays and the person who decides are different. And they might not agree on something like replacing a player. If rapport was bad, I can see a situation where you just carry on with your solid crowds off-court, let the coach run their course with their choices, and then make a move later.

As usual, I don’t care a great deal if people don’t put stock in my info. Not like it changes anything.

Boti has already said this 'Sixers have the fourth highest paid roster' statement is complete BS, which implies it's not even close to accurate. So if they're not even close to 4th it's very unlikely they're spending what Brisbane and NZ are then.

If the Griffin on $400k thing was legit he would've been cut during the probationary period of the contract as he had already been demoted to the bench. You don't pay $400k for a bench import, on a mediocre team too.

DJ re-signed to a 3 year deal in 2018 and Froling signed a 2 year deal in 2018.

Then/than

Yeah can absolutely see that scenario occurring Isaac.

As I’ve mentioned, I can see drawing players in might cost Adelaide overs to say “hey come/stay here instead of east coast”. Some sort of overs is to be expected on DJ Froling Drmic, then you’ve got “stud imports” in Randle/Griffin with perhaps cheapies to round out the roster.

I’m hoping they didn’t over pay for Kyei, Teys, Whtie, Dillon, Moore.

Hopefully Adelaide finds a way for Randle/DJ to work. IMO it requires Randle to be happy to move the ball more, DJ to be aggressive more consistently and acquiring a solid defensive big.

From there, look to get some serious sharp shooting - it definitely felt like 36ers were the worst three point shooting team in the comp.

Drmic is worth keeping IMO, I think Teys is better at doing what White does, there’s perhaps not space for both. Moore needs to be shed tbh. Froling IMO if he had more court time and shot threes at most opportunities he would be valuable however he definitely regressed this year. Don’t pay him overs, if 36ers are better off shedding then do it. Dillon has to go imo.

I’d rather see a depth of 8 solid players then a depth of 10 with 5 average players. Too little time stifles opportunity and confidence, it’s worth trying to get confidence in a player through non contingent opportunities then have them worrying and down on themselves all the time.

Most of us picked that this team wouldn’t work and lacked enough substance in talent to do well, and that occurred. 11 plus wins given the early expectations is not a bad effort.

Assuming Griffin's $400k, I can see how Adelaide are outspending Brisbane (one decent import; Sobey took less than 36ers offer to move there) and NZ (didn't bring back their stud big, have Abercrombie at the tail of his career, and a few others likely to hang around NZ rather than chase money elsewhere). $400k is a decent $150k import and then 5x $50k to juice up other salaries - it's not small change even in the current NBL.

Might be wrong on specifics of when they signed/extended, but let's say Ramone, DJ, Drmic, Froling, Teys are more or less locked in coming into this season. Then you lose Sobey, Creek and Wiley, freeing up their respective salaries - that's not peanuts, right? Do you overpay for roleplayers (who might not move states and come here anyway) or throw money at someone you think at the time is going to fit your style and have the moves to dominate? Then you're tempted to spend again to upgrade for Randle. At that point, you're thinking you have two stud imports, a stud forward, a strong roleplaying import, Drmic and Froling capable of contributing. Only Randle has a certain style, Griffin plays one end, Froling regressed, etc.

What were you expecting DJ and Froling to be on?

My info was Griffin 400k, DJ much more than I guessed. Randle not cheap. Froling more than I thought too.

$400k for Griffin?

I don't mind the Sixers spending a bit more given the extra revenue from more seats at the new home court.

But that is a rather poorly spent chunk of money.

Isaac, I find that very hard to believe about Griffin not doubting you but as we've seen the past few days there is some intentional misinformation being put out there about what the Sixers may or may not be spending.

I don't buy Griffin being on anywhere near $400k for a second. He got cut by three teams last season, has never played in the NBA, never played in the NBL before has bugger all collateral extremely poor defensively and if he really was on money like that obviously would've been cut earlier in the season to save money when he got demoted to the bench.

DJ being on big money? Yeah for sure he holds the club hostage every couple of years and will likely do it again at the end of this season. He'll threaten to go to Perth as always like Gleeson would want a bar of him lol

My info was Griffin 400k, DJ much more than I guessed. Randle not cheap. Froling more than I thought too. Drmic wouldn't be cheap. I'd guess the Sixers bench is very expensive given they're starting Teys and Kyei because Griffin doesn't play both ends.

I've heard from a couple sources that the 36ers were 3rd highest paid roster until Perth made their recent change. assuming correct, by God they've under-achieved.

I thought they'd finish dead last, have played way better than I expected especially against the likes of Perth and Sydney but they just felt awkward to me.

I don't see the Drmic, Goulding comparison as Drmic just seems so angry whilst Goulding tries so hard to have a swagger about him just so the comments can tell it to us incessantly.

I expect that Harry Froling would be on overs as his potential was clearly there when he signed and isn't he like making the NBA next year and being Jokic?

Taylor has turned into a very useful player for the kings, Adelaide might have been better with him, solid defensively.

Randle is an experienced European player

"He was still a free agent in October he wouldn't be on anywhere near that this season."

He was a free agent but that doesn't mean there weren't other options available around the world. Randle is an experienced European player

They can't be fourth.
Sydney, Melbourne, and Perth obviously ahead of them,
plus Cairns are the highest paid team in the league. Mike Kelly told me this himself.

See, I wrote it on the interweb, therefore it must be true.

Oh, and BTW my penis is 12 inches long.

It was clear as day the 36ers hired far too much mediocrity from the get go. Nobody was excited by what was on paper and most of us argued there was no chance of competing. Randle coming in probably added a few victories and ladder positions to the column, but as we also complain about Randle sets a ceiling with the way he plays stifling the movement.

I’d also hate to think teams finished based on how much they spent - thank god for Cairns!!

I'd hate to think we are top 4 spend only to end up bottom 3rd.

If true what are we paying for this crap?

Drimic would not sign for less money, who does that. Agents are in it to make a buck for their players and selves. McVeigh was talked up big time due to his junior Australian team performance though his college career was ordinary, but would have probably got good money.
Clubs should release there total salary cap, not players but totals and we would all no for sure.

Anon, what Drmic was on when he first started in the NBL is irrelevant he's signed a new contract since then which is now ending.

DJ opting out every 2 years to sign a big new 3 year deal has always been a problem for the team. Not only the pay but because he's so poor defensively it means someone like Griffin can't start we have to start Kyei instead.

DJ signed his current 3 year contract in 2018 the guy practically coasted last season then this season ramps it up even trying to play some semblance of defence now late in the season because I bet like always he opts out of the third year to become a FA again and holds the club ransom to a new big deal.

I just wish the Sixers let him go he knows Gleeson wouldn't put up with him in Perth so can't go back home, call his bluff.

Jack McVeigh and Harry froling are looked at as future NBA players so I guess it would make sense that they're on decent coin

Drimic was letting people no when he signed on how much he was on, 40g more than he should be. Most of there locals are on more than their equals from other clubs. Johnson is on big $$ as well, probably deserves it but put players around him that can defend. All this I go there for Joey as he’s the developer is crap, it’s money.

Keep in mind there are four players on the Sixers roster this season that no other team in the league including SEM would've offered roster spots to (Teys, Kyei, Dillon & White).

Teys despite having a good season this season was fortunate he got offered another contract, Kyei & Dillon weren't even in the league last season and White got released by the Hawks.

Lies

Boti is quite often right but not on this occasion.

The 36ers are paying overs for a lot of players and would be the 4th highest paying team, 5th at a stretch.

They are absolutely smashing it, credit to them!! Love to see it

God spending tier: Sydney
Royalty tier: Melbourne, Perth
Spend to be competitive tier: SEM NZ
Pleb tier: Brisbane Adelaide
Peasantry tier: Cairns, Illawarra

He was still a free agent in October he wouldn't be on anywhere near that this season.

Randle has historically been a 400k import

Yeah Boti has said this statement is complete BS.

I would've had the Sixers 5th maybe even 6th on roster spend.

I'm sure Boti didn't unintentionally leave out DJ either.

“ That is 100% bulldust. That "Good word" couldn't be further from the truth. Teys, Drmic, Froling, Kyei, White, Dillon there for Joey, not $$” from Boti

Any time you have a losing record, you’ve underachieved.

So if they're spending the fourth most, and finish sixth, have they underachieved

Umm yeah that's exactly what I was saying lol

Fourth highest paid team in the league sounds outrageous but I'm willing to bet Melbourne, Sydney & Perth are all spending at least twice the amount on their rosters than the Sixers are.

Zodiac, you mentioned 3 teams ahead of Adelaide potentially. That would indeed play into the rumour of being the 4th

Cooper said someone on the team told him that after Boti said it wasn't true.

Sexy headline but in reality the Sixers wouldn't be in the same stratosphere as Melbourne, Sydney and Perth.

Oh but apparently randle is on cheap money lol it’s been rumoured that griffen is the man who has taken a big chunk. But end is the day the team is terribly constructed. If they’ve spent a fair bit on this roster, that’s bad luck on them and who has been given the keys to put that roster together.

Depends who his source is. But this wouldn’t surprise me. They’ve over paid a few on potential. I’m sure jack McVeigh for example is being paid overs.

https://twitter.com/lukecooper14/status/1221247437790048256?s=20

There should be one? Or some kind of big skills camp? Adidas nations spots all the good talent already .

Maybe measure up current players and see who's actually athletic and which players are pure skill?

Current DP don't get enuf minutes to show what they got?
Bottom teams should flip there roster if there out of playoff race!